Yanagi

Sorry for the confusion, I know it's legal to collect water, I was referring mainly to the fish part of the discussion lol Depends on the quality of the rock. We sell it at $ 16.95 p/kg 4kg for $60 but it's covered in red and pink coralline algae and usually has coral on it (see my zoo rock and the piece with what appears to be some kind of encrusting coral and an acropora). Most of it is also pretty porous and good shapes for building foundations as well as shelves for coral. Most of the cheap stuff you'll find is just dull with nothing on it. Big boulders that you can't do much with, etc. You would have to go check it out for yourself. It might be cheaper up there even if it's of the same quality.

You don't want an internal filter, you want something that's going to hold more biological media which that ehiem internal doesn't. For the size you would need it's only about $30 cheaper than the 2213 canister, anyway. I have that ehiem internal and while it's a good filter it's got nothing on a canister.

I wouldn't use a HOB as the primary filtration on a 4ft tank. If your tank is understocked then you will probably get away with your current filter but I think you're better off with a canister. You can put a lot more filter media in one, especially biological media. You could easily go for an aqua one 550 or eheim classic 2213 (ehiem has far more and far superior filter media included) and continue to use the aquaclear. Undergravel filters are outdated technology IMO, but alright as a supplemental filtration in a non-planted tank. You don't need an air pump. Your HOB filter is doing the exact job that an airstone does by creating surface movement.

Nah, bright coloured zoos are far more common because no one buys the brown ones LOL. Oceanarium has some great zoos right now! http://www.oceanarium.com.au/item.toy?iid=512156 http://www.oceanarium.com.au/item.toy?iid=512284 <- Very tempted to buy that one for myself! http://www.oceanarium.com.au/item.toy?iid=512290 I think Aquarium Excellence doesn't really have enough blue light to really show off his zoos in photos but they are rather nice looking, especially the green and yellows. I am not certain his products are 'what you see is what you get' in terms of the photos though. Not to say they aren't nice coral, just that I'm not 100% certain he pictures the exact coral you're getting. If you follow the WPG rule with LEDs then I am growing coral with 1.3wpg. 2.5w x 10. I would really like to know the specs of that LED light, especially for that price. It looks like they've copied the AquaBeam design almost completely. If I had a nano I would be rather interested in that light but without knowing the actual details I wouldn't be putting my money forward. I'm not sure what area you're referring to with regards to collecting water and fish but it it depends whether or not it's a marine park or whatever they call it.. protected. There are also limits on fish including net size (although it's some ridiculous thing like nets must be under 2m long) and the amount of fish you can catch. I think it's 5 within 28 days and you cannot use any diving gear, I believe no more than a snorkel is allowed? I'm not 100% sure but if you're going to go in that direction you really need to do your homework because the fines can be huge and I believe there's the potential for jail time. You would also need a quarantine tank or be willing to risk everything any time you add fish. BTW, I am quite certain you cannot release critters once they have hit your tank. The octopus should of been killed.

http://www.oceanarium.com.au/index.toy Unlike most places, they take photos of the actual coral you're getting. I find the prices VERY reasonable too! They ship all over. Haven't actually ordered from them yet because I'm saving my pennies (or meant to be, anyway) but they have very good reviews on a couple of forums. http://aquariumexcellence.webs.com/ Not sure if they ship to QLD? I find the prices reasonable and got my BTA anemone delivered in good health. Haven't really looked at other online coral places.. I can generally get whatever I want from work but I am putting a halt to spending money on coral at this point as all funds will hopefully be redirected to the 4ft. What light did you go for? Thanks Busman. No need to be scared.. Oh wait. You meant the price? Yeah, be scared. LOL I've already shared my (future) expenses not including live rock and fish.. ouch. Oh, also, there's many many things in the marine world that can kill you. Or at least induce some serious pain. The salt alone burns at my skin but that's just a weird sensitivity thing I have, but many people if they get stung enough will also get tingling and burning sensations if they put their hand in a tank with the coral they're sensitive to. Oh and certain corals will try and harm you, like zoos. They sometimes squirt at you and I know of one person who almost lost his eyesight because of it. I won't even start on the fish LOL. Anyyywayyy... second hand set ups are usually very well priced. I loved the red sea max as my first marine tank but I'm ready to move onto bigger and better things. I am rather lazy with the tank. I test a few things once a week. Nitrate, Calc, Alk, pH, Phosphates, salinity etc. That is pretty time consuming, especially when you're hopeless like me and knock over the test tubes multiple times per test. Algae cleaning is the most time consuming thing. I could easily do it once a day but I leave it go for a few days and then attack with the scourer, algae magnet and a razor blade. On a good day that takes about 10 minutes. I suppose if I was doing it daily it wouldn't take so long but I do enough algae cleaning at work, ugh. I feed the coral with 'seafood' from aquasonic usually once a day, BBS every few days. Target feed the nems a once or twice a week or if I've got any new coral I'll usually target feed that for the first week or so it's in the tank. I don't have a deep sand bed so I gravel vac once a fortnight, which obviously includes a water change. Usually about 20-30%. Top up once a week generally with tap water aged and treated with prime but I would really, really like to get an RO/DI unit and see if that improves the algae issues. Empty the skimmer cup every few days. That thing gets pretty putrid. Um, really that's about all I can think of right now. I honestly find my planted tank to be more work because I'm dosing more stuff more often. This tank doesn't need it at this point. I'm sure once I really stock it up with coral that it will get to that point but certainly not now. If you were to go with FOWLR (fish only with live rock) system then that would be even easier.

WOW. That is all. :)

So. New fishies. 1 Freebie Fang Blenny who is extremely skinny. To the point of death skinny. Meet 'Slim Shady' the venomous blenny And the most expensive fish I've ever bought, an inch long Flame Angel And to show off the size of the zoo rock.. I had to place most of the zoos to the side/back because it wouldn't balance any other way and I can't sit it 'upside down' because there is more zoos on the 'top'! Argh. So nothing is getting much light and not really opening up the whole way. I think I need to split this rock into a few pieces... :(

My dad and I are actually looking to DIY some LEDs now. We'll see. Glad I've inspired you, just don't get yourself into trouble, lol. Coral gobyyyyy, get a green coral goby! Or a few. They're so freaking cute. I also have issues with the whole lionfish thing too. I have met more than one person stung by them but ugh, I'm paranoid about being just that little bit extra sensitive to any marine fishes venom. I'm already sensitive to salt water, one day I'll have to take a picture of what my arm looks like once it's been in the tank. No mandarins for me until the stay is well and truly mature (at least a minimum of 6 months.. probably far longer than that!). They starve to death too often. We had one in a display at work and he was literally skin and bone. Caught him one day and we were moving him into several nano tanks every week or so to try and keep up with the pace he was eating the pods. He was also taking frozen food but just couldn't get any in the display so now he was able to keep his belly full but geez, he wasn't looking much better after several weeks of that treatment. A customer bought him on the weekend. ( WHY?! Surely can't be that desperate for a Mandarin.. go get a bloody healthy one!) I would love one but no to mandarins when you own predators (the jury is still deciding that one) and no to mandarins in a new tank. :(

They are actually REALLY cool. We had one at work who would waddle over to me to get hand fed since he just wasn't fast enough to keep up with the other fish. They are toxic, though. I think it's when they're stressed or after they die they release some toxin that can wipe out entire tanks. I forget, been a while since I read that article. Grow huge, too. Over a foot or there abouts. Reef safe is iffy. Some will pick at coral... I'll certainly keep them in mind, though.

Bit boring for my tastes I think, plus they're a predator which rules out small fish again. I think they're supposed to be rather expensive as well so I doubt I could just ask the guys at work to order one in to see if I like it or not. I feel like I'm banging my head against a wall here, lol. I need to come up with a QT tank and put some coral in it to test out dwarf angels. Any who pick at the coral can go back, any who don't could go into the 4ft. Sound good? lol I love me some angels.

Because they're creeeepy. :blink:

See I've been bitten by the ones at work and laughed at it, then pulled the eel out from under the rock with him still latched onto my finger... Then I remember they get to like 3ft long and are designed to crush shells and swallow things whole. And they grow pretty fast. The snowflake at work is pretty chill but still he might not stay that way when he realizes he can inflict some serious pain. I doubt they follow the whole rule of 'don't bite the hand that HANDFEEDS YOU'. I may make a stock list of fish without the eel and one with the eel, but then I know I'd go without. Sigh.

I watched some videos of them on youtube. Uh, don't think they're for me. Not really very interesting.. They're pretty to look at but that's about it. Still have basically no idea what to stock up the tank with. Thinking now though Pair of Clarkii clowns (would need to find some big ones, which may be quite difficult. We only ever seem to get the juvies) or Maroon clowns (not too keen, seem to be quite aggressive) Either 4-5 Anthias (not sure which kind.. maybe threadfins) or 5-6 Cardinals of some sort, probably Pajama. Snowflake Eel Convict Tang That should be well and truly stocking capacity. I'll need to rehome the eel when he gets too big, though. Tang too. However.. I came across some photos today of injuries inflicted by snowflake eels. Yeeeah. Um. Having second thoughts. It was a lotta blood. Also the restrictions on fish is really putting a dampen on things. Why must I be so indecisive?! :(

Anything that's rotting will give you ammonia. Smooshed up deli prawn, a bit of food thrown in the tank, etc. Not sure where you can get straight ammonia. :blink:

To cycle get a big ol prawn from the deli, put it in a filter bag and smoosh it up good. Leave in tank until you can no longer walk past the tank without dry heaving. Leave to brew for a few weeks. I made a list of good fish for a 4ft tank for another member the other week so I'll copy and paste that. Some of my favourite groups.. Note that you may have to sell the Angels and such when they get big enough to snack on Rasbora.. Not that mine do. They haven't touched any of my little fish, not even my dwarf rasbora. 4-6 Angels 10+ Fire red rasbora 6 Dwarf chain loach 8 Praecox 5 Gouramis (Pearl look particularly nice in planted tanks) 10 Cherry barbs and/or Odessa barbs 8 Panda corydora 10+ Neons or Cardinals 5 Discus A pair of Apistos (love the opal borellis but they can be hard to come by) or Blue / Neon Blue / Gold Rams 10+ tetra or rasbora, I like rummynose with Discus Some peppermint bristlenose or maybe some Julii Corydora That should give you some ideas, lol.

Snowflake Eel Convict Tang Marine Betta ??? Never seen a Marine Betta in person to know if I would like them or not.

*Points up to a previous post* I will be getting the majority of stuff for this tank from Guppys. Although last time I ordered I didn't get the pumps I ordered, I got a crappy no name brand instead and the impeller shaft is already rusting on both. I will be kicking down doors if they send me anything other than what I order this time, especially since I am ordering the expensive stuff. Let me know if you need any help/advice with marine, Matt. PS plants are cuttings, coral are frags, haha. Quite a few of the zoos are opening up on the new piece. Looks like plenty of green ones with the yellowy/orange 'fringe' (I should really find out the proper/technical names for it...). Now I am not sure what to put on my livestock list. Snowflake Eel - Absolutely going into this tank without a doubt. Convict Tang - More than likely, yes. Will outgrow the tank, a larger one is recommended but I can take him back to work once that happens. Or knowing me, upgrade again. ??? And from that point onwards I am at a loss. There is plenty of fish I like, they just tend to not like each other. Plus the eel presents the problem of, well, snacking on anything he can wrap his mouth around and swallow whole. This is the main reason I don't have him now. If you've ever seen a compatibility chart for eels you'll see a whole lot of 'No's. But that's with adult size eels. Supposed growth rate with these guys is half an inch a month with good feeding. Sigh. I don't think I've ever seen so indecisive in my life.

I can't decide on lighting for my 4ft tank. Obviously I want to do it as cheaply as possible and that would mean T5s and a metal halide or two. Metal halides produce a LOT of heat though and that means chiller running all the time in summer. LEDs are a lot cooler but a lot more expensive and somewhat unreliable with sourcing. Tempted to get two 120W LED panels along with the triple T5s but apparently one of the people who were importing these dropped them like a hot potato but they really are the cheapest option and if they work, they work, right? ... Maybe I'll contact a few people selling them and have a chat about warranties. I love the aquaray LEDs I have at the moment but the price is just too steep to try and light a 4ft with them. I saw a brilliant idea in metal halide spotlights for highlighting parts of the tank/coral. I thought 'OMG BRILLIANT' then I remembered it's only a standard 4ft and I really don't have that much room to stack lights over the top LOL :(

See I bought my RSM130D for $600 with live stock, live rock, chiller, canister, etc in uh late january, lol. The old owner never managed to keep coral alive?? Not sure why.. I have had no issues even with the stock lighting, haha. Ouch.. Yeeah, my floor would not handle an 8ft tank, it would just cave in on it's self.. LOL. Don't you need a permit to dive for coral? I know in some areas you can legally catch up to 5 fish every.. 28? days. Something like that but couldn't find much info about coral. Also limits on net sizes. I could easily spend over $200 on anything marine related, especially at start up time... Scary thought, really. Gorgeous convict tang at work who is just adorable. I know the tank isn't really suitable for a tang but damn it, I want him. I can always take him back to work when he gets too big. I haven't seen many tangs that I like. I find most to be rather an eye sore. *glares at the brown tang in my RSM* My dad and I have been working on the cabinet and tank the last few days. Floor needed replacing (it was just chipboard with bad water damage) and sealing. Hinges needed replacing because they looked like they would just disintegrate within the next 5 times of opening a cabinet door. I also want to replace the little cabinet knob/handle things, they're just ruined. Also working on scraping the blue background off the tank so I can paint it black. Cabinet is going to be sanded back and stained or painted black to go with all the other furniture in my bedroom. Some of the zoos are opening this morning. Most appear to be bright green with yellow outer ring. I have no idea the names of colours people call zoos. I wonder if there's a list somewhere? Probably.. I should go find that. Love love love looking at Zoos under my blue LEDs. They're pretty epic. And man that's one big tank. Kind of jealous although I don't care to imagine how much it cost to stock that thing up just to lose it all. Ouch. I think we both need another job, LOL. Aquarium maintenance? Those guys make pretty good money!! I'm scared to go diving.. I get an allergic reaction to salt water already. Burns my arms, very itchy, etc. Wouldn't want to jump all the way in to find natural salt water does the same.. to my entire body! Ugh.

I don't think you read the fine print, Spanger. NO RETURNS!!!! Oh and welcome, Winston. What are you keeping/breeding at the moment?

Yan's Betta Pellets are 100% guaranteed* to increase the size of your pen... fish. Made from wholesome natural ingredients such as saturated fat, ash, that stuff off the bottom of my shoe. Your Bettas will love you and look forward to every feeding time! Will double your Betta's size within the first two weeks or your money back**!! * Not guaranteed. ** No cash back returns Also you may be a Nigerian prince. Send me your bank account details and all personal info and I will confirm this for you.

Ooh, always handy to have contacts. Not sure how much it will help though because apparently Guppys is selling the Vortech's BELOW cost price.. But every possible penny counts, haha. I can't always order stuff at cost price from work. Please find out for me. PS I loath filters... I hate filters!! LOL Still beats gravel vac'ing 20 tanks in one day though. Oh and we got some epic freaking live rock at work the other week and not much has sold (not many marine customers?? You would thing they would come out and thrive in the cooler months with no chiller running.. haha) so I went through it today and grabbed one super nice piece. Absolutely covered in zoos. Then I got it home and under my T5s.. and found a GORGEOUS tiny ricordia!! BOUNS! I'm a very happy Yan. Also found two tiny bubble tip anenomes on a piece I brought home a couple weeks ago. Bright green and very very pretty. Smaller than a 5c piece though. I love bringing home stuff and then finding all the little bonuses on it, haha. Sometimes you get some not nice stuff though.. I am sure I have a pistol shrimp somewhere in my tank and I got stung by a frogspawn coral at work. Blahhh. It'll take me ages to go over these new pieces of rock over the last few weeks and truly find all the cool stuff on it. :P